Arab Husbands & Sexual Relationships

Why are arab/muslim men so inhibited in their sexual relations with their wives? I am an American woman married to a Tunisian. I, along with several of my husbands friends wives have the same issue with our sexual relationships. Our men are selfish lovers and frankly have no clue how to please a woman, nor do they try.

Is this cultural because they are taught sex is dirty. And why are they so fast to be done?

By Diane

Related:
I Feel Rejected


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  1. pecola
    pecola

    Diane,
    I have to admit that I am pretty lucky in that respect to my husbands sexual desires. He is not a reciprocator in the oral department, please forgive me if I offend anyone, however he makes up for it by trying to elongate our love making. He really is in tune with my body and needs in the bedroom. In the beginning it was fairly quick but he could go maybe 3 or 4 times a day. We have narrowed it down to 1 time a day because of the business but it is very passionate and fullfilling. I have never really enjoyed recieving oral myself and his opinion on this when I ask him is that the woman areas is not as clean as the men's area. He says the men can wash thiers and that is it,however, the woman area is open and it bleeds and we use the restroom and our panties are covering it and it gets sweaty and blahh, blah, blah. lolol I myself shave, wash after using the bathroom each time and do all necessary things to take care of my area but still feel uncomfortable if he were to try that, but that is just me. I never enjoyed that.

  1. Diane
    Diane

    Pecola,
    Well, I don't give my husband that pleasure since he won't give that to me.....LOL!!!! How lucky you are!!! I am always left unsatisfied and resentful because it is always about him. At first I thought it was just him, but in discussions with the other "wives" it seems my husband and all his friends are PRUDES!!!! They even go as far as making us feel like we are "dirty" if we discuss how unfulfilled we are with their performance or lack thereof!!!!! Because my husband is muslim, I can't really discuss with him my past experiences with men and what I liked and disliked. He would be so pissed if he thought I was comparing him. What part of Tunisia is your husband from? (On a lighter note!)

    Diane

  1. pecola
    pecola

    He is from Kirouquan, I may have mispelled this. lol. I know in thier part of the country sex before marriage is a big thing. The women of Tunis don't practice sex like we do here. When the travel abroad for their studies to Europe and surrounding countries, they tend to maybe have a few one night stands or even have a realtionship with European women and or German women, especially tourists when they come to the country. They are not really sexually active until after thier studies but according to my husband everybody is different, there are some Tunisian men that are just terrible. I think he told me most of his skills came from pornos as opposed to experience. He is just a fast learner or a good liar. lololol

  1. pecola
    pecola

    Diane,
    Are the wives of his friends American? Is your husband an active muslim meaning does he pray and go to the mosque? We are like best friends to be honest with you. I am not sure what your communication was like before marriage. We were friends first which made the transition easy for me but awkward as well. We have always been able to talk about anything. He has his opinions which I have stated above about giving pleasure but I have voiced to him that although I personally don't require that kind of intimacy, I do feel that the way I cater to his sexual needs should be equal in how he caters to mine as well.I love to please him but when it is time,he knows how to do the rest. I guess I am blessed in that field.

  1. Diane
    Diane

    My husband is from Tunis capital. He claims to have only been with 4 women tops. If your husband is like mine, they are very attractive and know how to smooth talk you. I don't believe him about only 4 for one second...not that he seems to have experience...but because he's a man and he was 25 when we met. He lived in NYC for a while, and come on, he could get whatever he wanted there and since long term relations wasn't what he was into then sex was all about himself. Or am I just pesimistic....I don't know.

    How long have you and your husband been married? And, may I ask, did you convert for him? My husband and I fight a lot about religion. I am not a religious person but when someone beats me to death about religion, I stick with my roots. It is so NOT easy. I feel like I compromise everything and he compromises NOTHING and I get no benefit. Sorry to ramble.

  1. pecola
    pecola

    My husband says that he has had about as many as your husband and I say whatever. He is very handsome. lolol I tell him that I have had the same number as him to keep it even. lolol. I could care less. We met in Chicago about 4 years ago. It is quite the story actually. We had a crush on each other for a long time but I thought he was married and he thought I was married.He also has had alot of opportunity to be with different women but his work ethic to be honest, he doesn't have time. Never has. He works 7 days a week and is exhausted when he comes home. I don't worry too much. In the beginning it was a problem for me to handle because I can be very needy at times, he has taught me the virtue of patience which I greatly appreciate. Religion for him is there in his spirit and we always talk about it. I am not religious and he really is not either. He knows alot about the quran and we talk about different things. I actually read about it on my own. I want to know all that I can about his culture and his way of life and expectations. He would never ask me to convert. He says that IF I want to, he can take me to the mosque to speak with women that speak english to help me understand better. We have been married 1 year on June 4th.

  1. pecola
    pecola

    I do have to admit that there are times when I feel like he takes me for granted. He will see me do something wrong and then fuss at me about it and belittle me and then he will do the same and at that moment it is a different story. I make sure and let him know at that point, he is singing a different tune and laughing about it. He is very smart and I acknowledge that. He does have a temper sometimes and says things that are hurtful but he recants it later after the argument is over. He thinks that he can say whatever and forget that it never happened and of course I am a woman, I never forget. There are times when I let it go because it really just is not worth it. there are times when I just have to stand my ground. I tend to look first at what is going on in his life besides us and then try to figure out if that has anything to do with his lashing out. We have our days.

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    To Diane and Pecola!

    I read your posts, and found both of your stories quiet interesting. I might not be an expert when it comes to sex but I've honestly heard even Arabic women complaining about their husbands. I don't think Diane, that your husband does it out of selfishness but it's out of health issue it's called "a premature ejaculation"honestly people from North Africa suffered a lot the war...I am talking about the fathers....so some of the kids have been abused in a sense "beaten up" for any reason...That reflected psychologically on them, also they can't have any sexual activity until they get older or even get married. As you know Muslim women can't have sex until they are married. The new generations of Arabic women are educated about sex, even if they are not active until marriage,....as I told you I know few women suffering and going through the same problem as you Diane...
    My advice to you is help him get over this problem ...because He may be like a lot of guys ...just gets over excited about sex or maybe nervous and that makes him shoot too soon. Your best stategy is to tell him it's ok and that you will help him work it out. Guys with this problem feel like a failure so he will need lots of careful encouragement..
    Don't encourage entry until you both need it badly, or it will be over too soon again...He also can read books that may help him...If he really loves you...he will put his pride aside and will be willing to work it out with you...He needs to know that a woman with time if she is not satisfied ....can become frigid...then he will loose her for life...
    You can check this website:http://www.emedicine.com/med/topic643.htm

  1. PECOLA
    PECOLA

    Sihem,
    I have just enjoyed your posts here. you have always had some truly informative things to say. I thank you for that. It is funny that you mentioned the premature ejaculation because my husband actually told me that when we first had our date, he ejaculated 3 times with his clothes on.We just kissed. i never knew about the abuse of the men from thier fathers. I know that at times if they do something wrong, the parents could and would severely punish the kids for thier wrong doing.That was all I heard.

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Pecola!

    I'm glad you liked my post...Of course it's not all fathers hit hard their kids but I would say 95%...I don't blame them because they were abused by the colonists or their families themselves...so they took it off on their kids...but the new generation is different. When we talk about North Africa... they were under the French colonisation for several years, Tunisia, Algeria and Morrocco. Tunisia and Morrocco got their independence way before Algeria where the French stayed from 1830 to 1962, and called it French Algeria...The French people practiced all kind of torture and abuses, ...they raped the wives, killed kids,and destroy any source of income for the farmers...you can read all about it on the internet or watch movies like The Battle of Algiers....etc
    All the abuse affected psychologically the population...after independence, people who lived under the occupation were still affected so the only way they learned to communicate is violence...They don't take the kid aside and talk to him but they hit him thinking it's a better way to make him obey....Violence has never produced healthy people "Male or female" .....

  1. Randa
    Randa

    hey !
    been readin' the posts here and this is actually quite interestin'... im only 16 so maybe i could just say 1 thing in between all of this marriage talk :muslim arab girls are usually brought up with the notion that guys are not exactly the right people 2 converse with until u marry him/her but becoz i lived in jeddah my whole life, i met so many people from all around the world and came 2 realize that that was not so..it does get difficult wen u get asked out and all sorts of thoughts about " religion,parents..etc." start zooming across ur mind and u have 2 try 2 decide whether 2 say ya or no, but then again not all people think that way..i just tend 2 think 2 much and not really go with my instincts. anyway, just wanted 2 say that i admire all 3 of u 4 ur audacity in sharing how u feel so openly and actually making sense of the whole situation..lol!not gonna give any advice coz im not really in a position 2 do so but just gonna say one thing : i think that falling in love is one of the most beautiful things in the world and so once you do actually fall in love with some1..never let him go...

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Randa!

    You are a cuty pie!! I wish you from all my heart to fall in love with a person that deserves you...

  1. Randa
    Randa

    oh..!! thank u so much! if ur not already deeply in love, then i wish u the same!!!!!!

  1. Diane
    Diane

    Hello Everyone!!!

    Pecola, yes all my husband's friend's wives are American, some chose to convert, well, infact, all of them converted. I am the only one who didn't and really won't. All the wives though had very premiscuous lives before meeting their husbands and most of them have very low self respect and esteem, which made it easy for their husbands to come in and dominate their lives. I will admit my husband tries but for him it's like beating his head against a brick wall. I am stubborn and head strong!!! When someone tries to exercise authority over me, I let them have it!!! LOL!!! We fight alot but at the end of the day I know he loves me and I love him. We met in a night club on a Saturday night. Met for a lunch 4 days later, Friday he came home with me and we have been together ever since. We married 4 months after meeting each other. Mainly because he said he could not continue in our relationship without being married because of his guilt to Allah. At some points before we were married he could not get it up because he would start thinking about Religion. Ofcourse, I took it to mean that he wasn't attracted to me. My husbands excuse is that he is Hot Blooded and cannot hold himself. He tries to give me attention in other ways but he is so harsh that it doesn't help me get there it just irritates me.

    Yes he is now a practicing Muslim. However, he was not really until once we found out about our pregnancy. The whole world changed for me. He became obsessed with prayer and going to the mosque, preaching to me, forcing me to give up the things I loved. For example, I used to collect cherubs, prior to meeting him. Once we were married he threw them all away stating they were Haram....hundreds and hundreds of dollars and prized possessions gone because of his point of view! I am not allowed to drink anymore. But I do find ways to enjoy a drink here and there at lunch with friends, as well as when my husband goes home to visit his family.

    Shihem---I didn't know all that stuff about North Africa....It makes perfect sense to me for other men, but for my man....his father never laid a finger on him, so he can't use that excuse. I do think with my husband it is him being selfish. So many times afterwards he jumps up, gets dressed and heads to the "guys" houses. THAT ALONE DRIVES ME CRAZY!!!!

    My husband and his friends talk on the phone and visit each other more than WOMEN!!!! I guess it is because that is the only time where they can be with their people and speak their language but it is so terribly frustrating. And the way that when I go with him, the men separate off to themselves!!! I was never used to that! My ex-husband was always beside me whenever we visited friends or went out with friends.

    My husbands friend Ali came to my business yesterday to discuss troubles in his marriage. He and his wife met at the Mosque and did not date but just decided to agree to marry. They have been married only 6 months, she is 9 weeks pregnant and now they are talking about divorce. I asked him if he liked his wife, he could barely say that he liked her much less loved her. How they can marry without really getting to know you is beyond me. Now they are in a position where either they will stay together for the child, which will make the child and themselves miserable or they will divorce and one will be without their child. If they had just taken more time before they married maybe this would not have happened. She actually became Muslim on her own prior to meeting Ali. She is an African American woman, teaches and was in the military. Since she was Muslim, I guess I thought that they would be happy together, but they encounter the same cultural and racial divide as the rest of us even celebrating the same faith. I found it interesting that even 2 muslims cannot follow the same interpretation of their holy book. I told Ali, he has to understand, yes she is Muslim, but she was American first and the way we were raised and our values are not going to just go away. I suggested that he change the way he words things to her. Instead of saying you are not to leave the house without asking me first, say to her, hey if you want to go somewhere, fine, just let me know, call me or leave me a note. I told him demanding that she get his permission puts a bad taste in any womans mouth and then we rebel. Hopefully they can find a positive end.

    Sorry I am ranting but I am so thrilled to find a place to speak to others in my situation and to be enlightened. This is truly a wonderful site.

    Hope you all have a wonderful day!!!

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Ladies,

    It is about time you heard a man's point of view. I ma not startuing any fires here but merely explaining the questions you have. As an arab muslim man, we believe that there are roles in life. We do not, no matter how educated and open minded, believe in equality between men and women. Yes women have rights and they should be respected but men have rights that should also be respectd. As a result, we believe in ROLES in life, A woman and a man. The man duties are different than that of the woman. The man is the pilot of the family, and the woman is the copilot. So yes she has say and her opinion is worth listening to, but if it foes not convinve the man then his way should go. Some men abuse that and completely ignore the women.

    Arab men see kids as their extention in life and do want them to think and live like them. So when the mother is different, they fear the kids will learn her ways so they try to change her.

    Sex is such a personal subject that I can't speak for anyone . Why some men like to please women and some don't reflect on thier sense of equality I think. If i believed that my wife's duty is to please me and that is her job then I will get what I want and that is it. As for the premature ejaculation, it is common with american guys too, it is a disease, either psychological or physical... there are medications that help and there are things that can be tried. It is not the end of the world.

    Marriage should be based on 2 people sharing the same vison for a life. The two should want the same from life and then they will be happy. When one wants to drink and the other wants to go to the mosque... then these two will never last. Either one of them changes for the sake of the other or leave ...
    A comment for pecola & diane, you don't love your husband and neither does he love you... it is clear from your posts... so if you don't have kids then get out of this prison you call marriage. It sounds to me that there are two men in this marriage, you and your husband are playing the role of the man and that will never please an arab muslim man ...

    Again, I am trying to explain, not insulting, blaming or even giving my personal views, but rather the views of many arab guys I know...

    Good luck to you all. Please respect the privacy of your sexual life and no need to share with us how often you clean your private parts.. that almost got me to puke!

  1. Diane
    Diane

    Arabi:

    If you read all that I wrote you would know that I do love my husband and he loves me. But there is a HUGE cultural and religious gap that makes life VERY difficult. My belief is that if he left his country to move here to the US, then he should abandon his expectations of WOMEN in marriage. If he or any other man wishes to put people in "roles" then they likewise need to fulfill their role. FOR EXAMPLE, my husband likes that I have a successful job, make good money, sometimes working longer hours than him, but he doesn't want to pitch in with the house work, laundry and even....what should definitely be seen as mens work....cutting the grass in the yard (NOTE: I was cutting our very large yard in the middle of summer 9 months pregnant because he said he didn't know how to!). I worked, I cleaned, I take care of the grass and he still expects me to take care of him. If you all want traditional "muslim" wives then you should NEVER stray from your culture. And if you do stray from your culture then you should accept/compromise your traditional ideas. Period.....I would not move to another country and expect them to live life according to my culture. I would concede to their culture. I do very much like to consume an alcoholic beverage from time to time. When he and I met he enjoyed it too. Like I said, he did a turn about once we found that we were expecting our first child, we have 2 together now. I do not drink in his presence or in the presence of my children. And it is on a rare occasion that I do at all. I allow him to teach and raise our children muslim with no arguements. However, I know that once our daughter becomes a teen, Imed and I will fight terribly about everything in regards to her. I believe that a marriage is a partnership, 50/50. Each contributing equally. If I did not work and stayed home and had time to be the traditional wife with no financial responsibilities to contribute...then fine!!!! I would gladly do so!! But don't want the Western wife and all the fringe benefits that come from it while still expecting us to be at your beck and call. My husband is learning the harder he pushes the harder I push back. One day he'll give up trying to change me, as he should! I am not interfering in the way he chooses to raise his children.

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Diane!

    As an Muslim Arabic woman, I can tell you why you are having problems with your husband...
    If you love your husand, you need to adopt his culture, and his religion...if you don't want to convert it's your personal decision but at least respect his. When you got married to him you knew he was muslim...they are a lot of thing haram like drinking alcohol or wearing too open clothes, not respecting his religion nor his family. I defend the independence of a woman but to a certain extent...Muslim woman will never be equal to man..Allah created us like that...but it doesn't mean that we should be pulled on the side and not treated as we deserve...A woman should be spoiled by her husband and he should show her and give her all the attention and love. It's in our religion. Some men use the religion like they want, and mistreat their wives.
    The problem you are experiencing is very common when Arab men wether Christian or Muslim have when they marry out of their culture. You either change for him or leave him, because he won't change for you...we grow up in certain tradition and culture, and we are thought about the duty of the wife when we are young...even you get a high education and somehow independent but when you get married your husband and kids come first...we want our kids to grow in our culture and religion. We are not supposed to go out without telling them where we are ...it's out of respect...Also regarding your husband's friends when they stick together...is because they want to be comfortable speaking their language and other subjects that women shouldn't interfere....
    I personnaly when I meet with friends from my country I wont feel comfortable to have even a girlfriend from a different country staying with us...since we will be talking our language and about our country...etc I don't want her to feel uncomfortable and think we are talking about her.
    I personnaly will not marry a man out of my culture, for a lot of reasons...it's not racist but it's convenient ...we will understand each other more and raise the kids the way we were raised. Does it mean my marriage will be successful ? Allah knows...we may not get along for different reasons ..especially if he takes me for granted...
    Even I am tolerant, I won't accept that my husband leave me and go out all the time with his friends and leave me behind....
    As far as Ali...even his wife is an American Muslim, she didn't adopt the culture but only the title of "Muslim"...if she is truly educated about Islam ...she will change her way of living...
    I wish you good luck in your marriage...my advice to all None Muslim and none Arab wives married to a Muslim ones is to get educated about the culture and the religion...there are classes offered in college or even read books..if you want your marriage to succeed...

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    PS: Sorry I just read your new post...but it's unacceptable to have you do all the work...I am sorry to say that but he is lazy...Arab expect things from the wife ...but he has to fullfill his duty towards her...He needs to compromise and help you in the house..if he wants a housewife then it's a different call. I agree with you on this piont...you cannot have a wonder woman...

  1. Diane
    Diane

    Sihem:

    I understand your point of view, but again, "When in Rome do as the Romans do"....I do respect his faith in that it is his faith, his choice. I totally respect his family, though I have not yet met them physically. But when I met him he wasn't leading a pious, righteous muslim life....he was a player out drinking and clubbing. He led me to believe that was the way he was....not overly religious. I think religion, of any kind, is wonderful for those who follow and practice. Believing in something higher than yourself is a GREAT thing....I believe in God....I believe there is truth in the Bible and truth in the Koran. I have read and studied and often correct my husband in regards to many things. But there is a lot of good and truth in Christianity too..... I mean in Islam he is supposed to believe in Isa as well and respect him....but if my husband even hears the name Jesus he goes balistic.....I think being religious is fine, but when you try so hard to religious because your not really you become fanatical....my husband....he tries so hard to be good, when it suits him, that is overly so. He makes comments about things that IF he knew his own faith, he would not say or do. In the Bible it is aid that you should not be "unequally yoked". Well I am married and unequally yoked and I guess in both christianity and Islam, my husband and I will pay debt for ignoring our differences and jumping into marriage. But here we are and we will make it work (if we don't kill each other first, LOL!) If I were to move to Tunisia with him, my opinions would change and I would surrender to his culture...but right now, here, I don't have to! Besides if ever I converted, my family would flip out....And living in the south would be terribly hard for a muslimah. One of the guys wife wears hijab and just yesterday someone yelled at her in her car telling her to take tha stupid rag off her head. I would not myself to that for all the money in the world.

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Diane!

    I understand your point...If you husband was out in clubs and drinking with you when he first met you ..then he is changed radically after marriage ...it's really his mistake....you can't get back to your religion and culture and expect an American woman to change with you...He didn't show you his true self....He needs to take the consequences. As far as not helping is in the house..it has nothing to do with culture nor religion he just expect you to be American and Arab at the same time ...it doesn't work that way!! If he wants you to treat him just like an muslim woman ...he needs to treat you as one ..meaning he takes care of the bill and hard tasks and you cook, clean and raise the kids. wanting the whole package is not fair...

  1. dina
    dina

    oh wow diane,

    you surprise me, how you coping up with ur husband, seeems both of you are quite different. dont they say love is blind :D


  1. dina
    dina

    forgot to add, not all men are like that, and it differs from one arabic country to another , also, class matters.

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Diane,

    Your husband is a JERK. A man that asks his wife to mowe a yard in the summer while 9 months pregnant is not a man but rather a pig. I do not know what do you love in this guy! He obviously does not love you and has some serious mental issues. When my wife was pregnant, I would not let her do ANYTHING in the house, I did laundry, dishes, cooked and cleaned and allowed her to only work part time 4 hours a day at the max at her job. She works behind an office in a very comfy job, but I still insisted on lowering her hours. I am an arab and a muslim man. Sure not all men would go to that extent, but I have not yet seen or heard of a man asking his wife to mowe the yard. Please tell him I think he is a disgrace to arab men and a pig in the true sense of the word.

    As for your understanding of "when in Rome do as the romans do" that does not apply to muslims. Islam is not a religion to us but more of a way of life. So just because we moved from Arab world to the USA, that does not mean that we will live like the Americans. It is a fact that we port our moral values and beliefs with us and live by them. We do not give them up. Sure your husband was drinking and sleeping around, he did that because he deviated from our culture. It was a mere deviation to him and now he is back to his roots. It is wrong of you to expect him to become American just as much as it is wrong of him to expect you to become a traditional arab wife. If you two TRUELY loved one another, you would meet half way and work together.

    I always tell people that love alone is not enough. I dont think there is love in your relationship. But even if there were, you need to meet halfway. Something your husband will never do.

    Diane, one more thing, if your husband tells you that arab wifes would work fulltime, do all the work in the house, raise the kids, and take care of the yard... then he is lying to you. Not one arab woman these days or even in the previous generation would accept a life like that. Unless she had self esteem issues or have mental issues. I want the arab women of this forum to tell Diane how they live and how their husbands treat them... Take a trip to Tunisia diane and see for yourself, poeple back home live a much more modern life that your husband does... I hate him and his likes, sick people who hide behind religion...

  1. Arwa
    Arwa

    omg, Arabi, how can u say that... I know u might not agree with what he did, but dont go insulting someones family like that! Diane... i kinda understand your frustration... no, i'm not an american married to an arab lol... I live in Canada, I'm 100% north african, and I have an uncle who married a canadian woman. I was very happy to see that u are allowing your kids to be raised as muslims. U dont have to convert to amrry a muslim man... just as long as the kids are muslim, its alright. My uncles kids... i dont even KNOW what they are. lol... and u know the whole cultural thing... u dont have to become tunisian... that would be stealing away your own identity. u are american, and your husband is tunisian... your kids are both, and it is both your responsibilities to make sure they know it. My uncles 2 kids (1 boy, 1 girl) barely seem to be related to me. The guy was in my home country when he was about 4 (hes now 17) and the girl (12) has never been there. I hope your children dont lose that half of their identity... its a rich culture, and it would be a shame... I'm glad to see an american woman who is willing to compromise like that... but I just wanted to add, the whole abuse thing that was talked about earlier... thats an exaggeration... 95%? every culture has child abuse, and parents all tend to "spank" their children... i dont want u to get the wrong impression here! and the part where u mentioned it was gonna be hard when your daughter becomes a teen? haha, u are sooo right... basically, from the sounds of how strict that husband of yours is, no dating, no parties,no drinking, no lotsa things... like sex b4 marriage (even tho he did all that...lol... so like arab men, to be hypocrites)... ya, i hope i helped with my view... remember, u live in america... its a lot different than living in an arab country... so a lot of the advice here doesnt totally apply to u.... be proud to be american.... u dont have to be forced into another culture... but im sure u appreciate it!

  1. Arwa
    Arwa

    i agree with Arabi, about how islam is a way of life... but your husband, Diane, is not the best example of a muslim... if he wants to raise his children right, he should be a good example... and he shouldnt criticize u... i mean, look at his own history... i dont get why some arab guys (when they leave their country) seem to forget religion and culture behind... only to bring it out when around other muslims... lol

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Diane!

    Arabi just comfirmed my point....he is right...
    Your husband has some issues, not only sexual dysfunction but also mental....sorry to tell you that. I haven't seen any Arabic Muslim Man treat his wife the way he does...You need to have a a serious talk with him....

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Diane, I apologize if I insulted anyone, I just call things the way I see them. On another note, your husband could be suffering severely from his inability to perform in bed as well as he would like. He then turn around and boss you arouund in somehow make himself feel like a real man. I think if he can see a doctor and get treated, he will lighten up a bit.... and if he still treats you bad, then send him my way, I would like to teach him a few lessons ;)

    Sihem, WOW you have guts getting in here and speaking about sex. I admire your courage. I am just surprised the ignorant hasn't attacked you for that yet :)

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Arabi!

    I was thinking about the same thing!! lol
    I wonder when the attack will start...hahhaha..

  1. lula
    lula

    hey everyone,I read ur posts and I can relate in a way to Diane's situation. My mother is american who converted to Islam and my father is egyptian, my dad doesnt think i know this about him but, he used to drink and club and even have premarital sex because I figured it out and he totally changed after he and my mother got pregnant with me. According to my mother at least, he used to be laidback and outgoing now he is strict and tense more hypocritical than ever. So take my advice as a daughter, work with him and I know it is hard to take because u were brought up in an american family and u are truley independent in many ways however u are a great wife and mother, either divorce him beofre ur children get older or work with him to find a middle ground for your kid's sake. My parents argue so much and it kills my brother and i but my mom reminds me of u. All in all they love each other so much but just have different views on life. My mom has adopted Islam and has no problem at all she accepts the Egyptian culture and loves my egyptian family and vise versa. They have been married about 20 years now and they will last but if my mom was not so laidback they would have been divorced. If u do not convert then ur marriage will never work believe me for ur children's sake do it and everything will fall into place. Your husband will never change his values or his religion because of who he is and no Arab Muslim Man will because of fear of the consequences. I hope I have not offended u but I just wanted to tell u my opinion from a daughter's prospective. P.S when ur daughter gets to be a teen it will be tough because ur husband will give ur son(if u have one) more freedom and priveleges even if he is younger because he is a boy and it will be tough on u and ur daughter but its just how life will be. If your daughter fights back it cant hurt because I have made many persuasive arguments to my father and he has given me so much. Make sure they are close and sucking up works well too lolol. The closer they are the more priveleges she will get also the more honest she is the more she will get from him. Just a little advice. Please dont be offended in anyway by my comment I just thought it would be helpful. Best of Luck
    *lula

  1. Rose
    Rose

    Sihem .. you are her expert in sexuality I thought arabian girl will not post any in such subject because at least according to our culture and really I don't know from where you know all this information of soon shooting ect. you are realy!!!!!

  1. the truth
    the truth

    hi everyone ....
    how should i start well i'm really surprised of the way your husband acted with you while you were pregnant diane i'm really sorry to here that but please are you sure .... that he didn't act in any different way he just said i don't know how to do it because that does sound to crayzy to me and maybe you didn't explain it well because as i said i'm still really surprised of that ....
    well as a conclusion beleive me if you love your husband first and your childrens second then let it go and be more comprehensive with him and more lean when accepting his differents ideas that might sound crayzy to you .... cause trust even if he was different before when you first met him and which was abvious that he was doing wrong with his religion and his culture but now it seems that he's taking the right way he suppose to take it and bleive me again it like beating on a metal wall he won't change himself backward or just let the life around him be or become or will be totally americain no way .... period that how it is one after one and day after day .... things will be okay but remember to be the nice person you are but never think that he will surround to the americain way of living inside the family and let his wife control him like it may be happening in the usa which's nothing wrong with it for the most of the americain men who accept that but that will be never the case for your husband who's an arabic muslim men ...
    but i still wondering you must have heard some about arabic or muslim men before you met him and you still accepted him as a husband but you kind of sort of want to compete with him ... which may cuase some extra problem so i'm wondering why did you still choose that men espically him and not someone else ...
    thank oyu diane for your understanding to my opinion :+)

  1. Mistika
    Mistika

    Rose,

    If you are so innocent yourself how did you understand what she is talking about? You are such a hypocrite.

    Sihem, funny, Arabi warned and Rose delivered. Im thinking Rose is Arabi and Arabi is rose!!

  1. Magda
    Magda

    FOR GOD'S SAKE WHY DO U HAVE TO MENTION MUSLIM IN EACH AND EVERY SINGLE TOPIC U POST!!!!!!
    if u WERENT lucky to get on of the good ones then dont speak generally abt all the arab or muslim men
    stop posting political topics that would provoke any race or any religion...
    for the past 3 weeks i didnt post any comments bec all what i can find is stuff speaking onllly abt arabs or muslims
    i am not trying to deny that there are alot of flaws in here and i strongly understand that some of them are right
    but try to think how will this affect every1 else and how ur hurting the whollle race!!!
    no offence

  1. Magda
    Magda

    btw i havent read any comments and i think i should've before posting that...
    i am sorry if i was rude
    i didnt mean to be at all
    to none of u
    i am speaking generally...
    SORRY AGAIN

  1. amal
    amal

    mistika we learn from the dvils like you, when we posts through a respicatfull sites, we find the greart professors and doctors wants us to be shutuped mouths!!!!

  1. Diane
    Diane

    I appreciate everyone's advice. I didn't seek my husband out, but when he introduced himself to me he first said he was French, only later did he really explain to me where he was from. I had never even heard of Tunisia! When we began talking about marriage, I plainly said to him that I didn't want what my understanding of an Arab male to be (controlling, abusive etc.) He assured me that those were people from Jordan or the other Middle East areas, that he was no where near the Middle East and that Tunisia is very much like America in their ideas and women's rights. That even if we one day moved there, which we have bought land in El Houraia, that if we divorced his gov't would force him to leave the kids with me. And in general was not like that. And everything I knew up to that point indicated he wasn't! My husband can be very sweet and loving and playful as long as I am subdued and not fussing about things. Which I do fuss alot as I am tired of taking care of all domestic work. For instance last night we had a fight because I didn't cook him dinner. I didn't get home until 7PM and he was still working and I had worked all day and I wanted to just be with my kids. What did I hear from him "What a woman you are, you don't cook your husband dinner.... %^%^ ...whatever foul language he uses in his language. But then there are times where he is so wonderfully sweet and that is how I want him to be all the time.

    About mowing the yard..... I was 9 months pregnant and it wasn't that he said to me "you have to cut the grass", it was more that he ignored it needed to be done. It didn't matter to him that our son could not play out in the back yard because the grass so high and unsafe. It didn't bother him a bit. So I had to just do it so Ramzi could play out there. I guess I thought once I got the mower started and began cutting the grass he would come out and finish it. It never happened. When I confronted him about he said that the exercise is good for me and the baby. If anyone knows what summers in VA are like you know that an average day is 95+ and humid. To this day though, I don't let him live it down. Even, at times, reminding him in front of his friends when he belittles me for silly things. His friends have defended me on that point! I want him to be shamed for his actions. But, even with all this being said, I think I am luckier than the other wives of his friends. They are weak, cut off from their families and, I know of atleast 1, whose husband ridicules and beats her. What I don't understand is that she is the most religious one of the wives, even went to hajj this year....and he still finds ways to make her be inadequate for him.

    When I first met my husband he was so "HOT", so to speak. I could not believe that he was even talking to me. After a couple of weeks, I was still baffled. I am not terrible looking but I am slightly, not much, but slightly overweight as I had a daughter from a previous marriage. He could have done so much better. That old 50's song played in my head "if you want to be happy for the rest of your life, never make a pretty woman your wife, so from my personal point of view get an ugly girl to marry you!" I truly felt that way and even thought he married me for papers. He told me that if he wanted papers he could have paid any girl in NYC to marry him for 2,000.00 so he could get his papers and he would never have to see that girl again. But he chose to marry for love...so he said.

    When I said "When in Rome do as the Romans do", I did not mean for him to abandon his faith or morals. I meant that he should let me continue to live in the way in which I am accustomed. I would never ask him not to go to the mosque or go slaughter a lamb on their holiday. I respect that part of his life. But he has taken away from me Christmas, Easter, Birthday and all other non-muslim holidays. I love Christmas and as I explained to him, it isn't about any religious meaning for me. It is the tree and lights and season of giving. But he makes each holiday very sad for me. Though we go to my parents for Christmas day, he makes me miserable the entire time he is there with his "Stufrallahal atheem", whatever that means (my 2 year old son says it anytime he doesn't get his way now too.).

    I completely respect his holidays and celebrate them with him to an extent. I refuse to go to the Mosque though as I don't want to wear hijab. But I encourage him to take the kids with him. I would never keep his kids from knowing their family in Tunis either. My son, who will be 3 in July, has been to Tunis twice during Ramadan for 1 month at a time. My husband wants me to go with him this year during Ramadan so that he can take both our son and our daughter. For my first visit I do not wish to go at Ramadan. Not because of the fasting but because those people stay up all night during that time and I like to sleep. They are all too social for me!!!! LOL!!!
    I told him I would go once he has built our house. I suggested that this year he take Aya and leave Ramzi with me...he didn't like that!

    Oh well! I so appreciate the forum here and the responses from each and everyone of you. It is hard to be in love so deeply with someone you really can't stand. BUT....I DO SO LOVE HIM...for the tender times and the past we share. Though he has hurt me emotionally and mentally many times, I have learned how to bring him to tears as well. It is terrible to say but I like to see him broken and in tears, because then I see his heart.

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Diane,

    Your husband is a copy of many muslim arab men. Almost all the guys that come from arab world that go to night clubs pretend to be italian, french and so on to attract women. They are afraid to tell a girl they are arab so they are not rejected. Some of these guys never been with a woman, and will go out with any woman that breathes.... These exact same guys, in a bout 5-10 years later, will start pretending to be the most religious and such good people. I think they try to make up for their past by exageratting in being "good" now.
    I am very fortunate to not be one of these guys. I never went out clubbing claiming that I am italian to get a girl to sleep with me. I never justified lying and cheating to get a girl. I have sisters and I never can imagine wanting anything like that for them. When I use this argument with these guys, they tell me don't compare the american girls to our sisters, that is because the american girls are of less value and deserve less respect.

    Diane, I know about 6 couples like you! The guys married the women for the green card and the women got pregnant later, or, the guys got the woman pregnant so he marries her. Then, when children are involved the guy suddenly fears that his kids will turn out like him, a person with no morals married to the "american woman". Trust me, everyone of them wishes he married a girl from his hometown. They feel trapped and hate the fact that the mother of their kids is a non muslim. Even if the wife converts they will still feel bad that they married a woman with a "past" (past sexual experiences and so on)... You can never please these guys.

    They now are religious and for some reason start to believe that they know the right way and any deviation from what they think is 7aram. Suddenly, everything becomes 7aram and even things that Islam allows become 7aram.

    These guys don't follow Islam. Islam tells them to respect their wife and treat her very well. Islam's teachings about women far exceed what women ask for. But guys like your husband, chose to ignore this part of islam and chose to practice the part that benefit them.

    Diane, your husband has gotten to the point that if you will allow him, he will become more abusive and he will start physical abuse as soon as he thinks you will take it. The plan is to mentally abuse you to lower your self esteem and then treat you like one of his belongings. I hope he does not think like that but he fits right into this style.

    If you decide to stay with him, do so for your kids. Don't ever move to his hometown and live there for he has more power there, legally and socialy and he will abuse those powers.

    Many arab muslim men are loving caring and just plain old good men. These good guys are religious too. Religion teachs love, acceptance and generosity.

    I am sorry for what you are going trhough. You say you love him, I really wonder if he does love you... both of you need to be nicer to each other.
    I am sure Diane that you are guilty of a lot yourself ;) You sound like a tough woman. As for your friend that gets beaten up, tell her that she is a human being and should not put up with that.

    I practice family law and defend a lot of women that are abused. I do this for a living and being an arab most of my clientele are arabs. I am speaking from 10 years of dealing with this. It sucks. I am thinking of practicing someting else as I got so sick of these sad stories...

    My offer to teach your husband a few lessons still stands....

  1. Diane
    Diane

    Arabi:

    I am tough and am guilty of being spiteful, as I said I reject any person thinking they have "ownership" of me. I know the rules of Islam and Christianity. In Chrisitianity it says that God is the head of Christ, Christ is the head of man and man is the head of woman. But being Christian I still disagree with that. I didn't like my parents being authoritative with me either growing up. I was good kid and never did anything terrible, so I resented people insinuating that I would or could do something that would prevent them from trusting me.

    Many times I had thought about converting in the hopes that it would make our life easier but even if I converted my issue would still remain because I can't change that part of me. I am strong willed. Little stuff like going to the beach and not wearing a swimsuit so that I may enjoy getting in the water too will always bother me. Why should I sit out in the hot sun watching him enjoy the water well I am suffering. I am very willing to compromise and have on so many levels. But he refuses compromising. I have offered him divorce MANY times. Taunted him with "come on just say it 3 times and we're done, you'll be free to find what you want". He retorts that he will never divorce me. I am his wife better or worse.

    It's funny...when we were married, the minister asked me if there were any changes I wanted made to the vows and I said yes, "Please remove the part about obeying", and she did. So when I married him I did not promise to OBEY him.

    I was looking at a web site called www.freemuslims.org....I liked what they stood for and if I believed that the majority of muslims held their same views converting would be easy (well except for being a southern baptist, turning my back on Christ and the fear of eternal damnation...lol!) I truly feel that if islam was as this group portrays it, then it would be positive to me. They seem to be so moderate. When I discussed it with Imed, he simply said "Please the American Gov't put that site together to trick Muslims into believing in their politics".

    Arabi, if my husband were to physical it would probably be in response to me getting physical. I have been known to slap him in heated arguements. When he has pushed back at me, I would then use it against that if I hit him he is a man and should just take it. So you are right, I am not innocent in everything. But I was never like this before him. It's like if you put an animal in a locked up space, they will fight in any way possible to survive. That is why I lash out.

    If I never move with him to El Houraia I will forever hear "you are my wife, where I am you are"...Right now I play the card of my older daughter, how she would feel if I left her here with her father and moved out of the country. So the issue of moving there has been pushed off at least 10 years, my daughter is currently 9.

    I appreciate your offer!!! LOL!!! What I don't get, if my husband is like what you last posted, is why? Why do they do this if they know they won't be happy and/or they don't love their partner, why get married? Why marry for papers? I mean it's not like he even likes being in the US. He said that when he first came here he thought money was lining the streets. He had a choice to come here or go to Dubai.....he should have gone to Dubai!!!! (Which I wouldn't mind that either, from what I have seen on the Arabic Satelite it is BEAUTIFUL!) But he came here and once he realized it wasn't what he thought he should have gone home. Papers should not have been an issue.

    But let me ask this...since you are an attorney...Could he at any point take my kids to Tunis and not return them? Would Tunisia not recognize our marriage?

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Mistika!

    I was expecting the ignorant's attack at anytime...She claims to be a doctor...People who studied biology are pretty aware of human body and what it comes with it....Also educated people are curious about all different fields..

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Diane,

    What a marriage! and dont believe everything he says. He came to the US for a better life and he has a better life than he would have had in Tunisia and in Dubai. Nothing compares to life in the US. He married you for papers because he came here and figured out this is the place to live and wants a way to stay here legaly.

    Can he take your kids and fly to Tunisia? Sure he can. Would it be legal? that a total different question. I cannot give u advice here. Every state has its laws, however, usually you can prevent him taking kids and flying out. If you ever feel that is a possibilty, then go see a family law attorney in your state. Things can be done to prevent that. Will Tunisia send them back to you? I don't see why. Some arab countries have treaties with the us for child kidnapping. I don't know if Tunisia is one. But trust me, as always, prevention is much better than having to deal with getting your kids back.

    As for you, you too are messed up ;) I say that with the hope that you understand that you have issues to take care of. I would not blame your husband if he beats you up since you do that. Violence, anger and resentment is no way to live and no way to raise a family. s\Seek help for you and your husband...for the sake of the kids

  1. Randa
    Randa

    a youngster's POV :

    im 16, but i really do have an opinion here..that sort of makes sense. diane, u seem 2 be a very independent and headstrong person and ur husband a man of certain values that, for some odd and unknown reasons, keep changing. so, if i were in ur shoes, and truly in love with him ( u mentioned that u asked 4 divorce so u gotta think about whether or not u luv him), then you guys should try marriage counselling and maybe that will help.i would never want my parents 2 continue in their marriage if not in love coz it would reflect on me.oh and that part about physically attacking him and then saying that he's a man...not right coz then he could do something really annoying and that will totally piss you off and then say that you should handle it "coz ur a woman" !!! so,just do what your heart tells u 2 do...or do what i do and listen 2 avril : " who knows what could happen, do what u do just keep on laughin',there is always a brand new day..im gonna live 2day like it's my last day!" ...

  1. Diane
    Diane

    I offered him divorce because I feel that if he doesn't love me he should not be married to me and I love him enough to let him go. You know the old proverb, If You Love Someone Let Them Go, If they come back they are yours to keep....I believe that. And he never leaves, he comes back to me with his heart in his hands.

    I want to be happy with him, I do. Counseling...he would NEVER!!!! He would die just knowing that I am talking to you guys here. He is very private about our marriage. I even offered once to go with him to talk to an Imam and he wouldn't.

    Arabi, well, if he wanted his papers and that's all he should go now. He is one month away from being a naturalized American Citizen. He would be free to divorce me then would he not, and still be legal to stay here? So I guess time will tell me his intentions. Right now it would be too heart breaking to think that he used me.

    I am going to talk with him about composing some legal document that would be sanctioned by the law here in the states and by the Tunisian Consulate. Something that would protect my rights to my children in both places. I will do this when we are in good spirits so he is level headed.

    I guess we are quite dysfunctional...but as I have said before, I do love him, I don't always like him, but I do always hold him close to my heart. Before our children life was great! Maybe when the children are more independent we can rekindle that part of life. When he and I go out alone even now there is a weight lifted off of us...we are free to just be us and that is a beautiful thing.

  1. Randa
    Randa

    i know that proverb...and i don't believe in it..! well, im sorry counseling would not work with you coz in theory...it seemed like such a good idea ( i guess i watch 2 many movies!). anyway, good luck and i hope things work out between both of u !

  1. PECOLA
    PECOLA

    Hello to all
    SOrry I have been out for a few days and I just printed all 25 pages to catch up and I am still not done, I am responding to only what I have read thus far.
    Arabi,
    First I would like to apologise not only to you but to all Arab and muslim women and men that have read my post to Diane describing about the cleanliness issue referencing the post on how she does not feel like she is being satisfied in the bedroom. I thought about it as I was typing but I just wanted to help her understand what I meant. I am sorry for the graphics. In response to the you don't think my husband loves me, or better yet I don't love my husband,( no disrespect sir, You need to read it all over again and I mean from the beginning to the end because you seem to only read what you want to read) My husband and myself have a partnership. We occasionally have our differences but we actually talk about everything. We even talk about everything I type right now and the repsonses. He actually told me to explain to Diane his views on sexual realtions, and how I keep myself. I am not bragging but I truly feel lucky. There are some things that Diane talks about and I can totally relate. Muslim, Arab and chinese..whatever, everyone has their differences. My husband tells me all the time, don't think what I tell you is because I am arabic or muslim and don't think that all muslim and Arabic people are like this or that. We teach each other and it works great for us. I know my place in the relationship. I am nor beneath him or over him. We are together. We discuss everything before it happens.
    Sihem:
    You are just awesome!!! I love how you look at both sides of everything and you read over the posts BEFORE responding. :) You really give alot of thought.
    Diane:
    THE GRASS WOULD NOT HAVE GOT CUT!!!!!!
    I think that sucks!!! I sympathize with you because I know it is very difficult. My husband and his friends are awesome. We work together on different projects. His friend is an engineer and we do construction projects on the side. They speak thier language and it doesn't bother me. We all laught together, but there are times when I choose to seperate myself from them because I don't want to know what they are talking about. My ex used to be around everybody as well but he understood us all. My husband has only met 1 of my friends and that is my best friend and we never really have time to socialize outside of us and the business and his friends. His friends love me and I love them too. I want to understand everything and it is not easy but I am coming along. I do wash all the clothes, wash the dishes, clean the house and mow the grass and still work a full 45 hours a week, but I don't mind because he has 2 stores and he is never around but when he is home and he has nothing to do...He will help clean the kitchen or help me organize but I never minded doing it. I feel honored because he is bustin his butt for the sake of our family and make sure he knows he is not alone. We are all we got.

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Pecola!

    Thank you for your nice comment. I really think that you are a good person and a great wife. You love your husband that's why you compromise and try to be as close as you can to the Arabic wife. Arabic men wants to be respected, have food on his table and satisfied in his bed...If you make him feel that he is the head of the house, you can be the neck and get things done your way without making him feel it. He will love you and respect you and will never cheat on you. They don't like when a wife start beeing stubbon and doesn't listen. They are very special....I am not saying that they are easy ....no they are not but if you make them think you listen ...you'll be their queen....
    I wish you a lot of happiness with you husband and kids...When you go back to visit Tunisia you'll love it ...It's a beautiful country...

    Diane!

    Let me tell you this...We all came to the US for a better life...not only to have a financial freedom but also a personnal freedom. God bless this country...We have a great constituation than any country in the worold...
    Anyone who come to the US get edicted to it..can't leave. Most of the Arab guys get married with Americans for papers...it doesn't mean they don't love them...but the initial though was green card. If the American wife adopt their culture, they will love her more and keep her for life. If she starts giving them headache, even with 13 kids, they will leave her,....I hope it's not your case, but honestly you can win your husband "you already have a plus..your kids" by beeing less aggressive, try to understand him and understand his culture...learn how to cook CousCous and surprise him ...Do some special things for him...If he treats u the same way.it means he doesn't love you...Do it for the sake of your love to him and your kids.
    I honestly believe if you start paper work about the kids, and made him aware of it ...It will create a lot of problems....he will know that you don't trust him...
    Good luck to you...
    PS: Islam is a great religion...try to read it and understand it from your own prospective, not what people tells you....It's always great to learn...

  1. pecola
    pecola

    Sihem,
    You are exactly right. I think it will cause alot of problems if you start with the papers. I think and again this is only my opinion,take the time and talk about the situation but not when you are angry or he is angry because what you want to say and the way it comes out will be totally different. I am going to say more tomorrow after I read the rest of 19 pages.lol

  1. pecola
    pecola

    By the way!! I know you may not feel compelled to do so because of his behavior towards you but maybe you can try and discuss everything after to try to make him some of his traditional dishes like Sihem said. Learn to make the CousCous and Lamb if you have not already done so and place some candles and make it romantic and tell him without the kids being anywhere around that you needed this time to talk to him about a few things that have been on your mind lately and that you want him to be understanding and not get angry because you just want to talk to him so maybe you guys can resolve. I hope that doesn't sound to lame to you but the effort from your part may make him feel more compelled to open up a bit and compromise. Marriage is about compromising and keeping each other happy.I think you can do that.

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Pecola,

    No need to get agressive here. You love your husband and he loves you... good for you and hope you stay loving each other for the rest of life.... it makes no difference to me!!!! I think you posted on here knowing that you would get peoples opinions.. you got mine... u don't like it, trash.. or even don't read my posts.

    Most of my advice was targeted to Diane... I feel sorry for your husband with that attitude of yours... he must treat you equally to avoid the attitude!

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Pecola,

    Where is the love in what you posted? Your post showed lack of love, read what youwrote before asking me to read it!
    Pecola said:
    "I do have to admit that there are times when I feel like he takes me for granted. He will see me do something wrong and then fuss at me about it and belittle me and then he will do the same and at that moment it is a different story. I make sure and let him know at that point, he is singing a different tune and laughing about it. He is very smart and I acknowledge that. He does have a temper sometimes and says things that are hurtful but he recants it later after the argument is over. He thinks that he can say whatever and forget that it never happened and of course I am a woman, I never forget. "

  1. Diane
    Diane

    All:

    In reading all of Pecola's posts I never took away from it that she did not love her husband!! Just because she didn't sugar coat the relationship doesn't mean that she in anyway does not lover her husband.

    I have tried very many times to prepare his dishes...the fact is...I am a VERY POOR cook. I was never taught how to cook anything other than the traditional meat and potatoes...(I'm Irish). What usually ends up happening is I spend all day trying to get the jist of how to prepare the meal, go to the Mediterranean store for the halal ingredients, go home fight with the kids to behave and stay out of the kitchen while I try desparately to cook him something that, if his mother prepared, he would love. Unfortunately, when he gets home and sits down to eat, there is no appreciation for the effort. Instead I hear, "I'm sorry, don't be angry but this just isn't couscous....etc." From that point on I am hurt....it tastes fine but not made the way he would want it. I then am left feeling unappreciated, sad and angry. If he didn't like it fine...you don't have to tell me that. It makes me not want to try to do it again, EVER!!! But ofcourse, down the road I do try again and the same result. I no longer eat with him. I fix dinner and I go to bed for him to eat alone so I don't have to feel that inadequacy. If only he could love spaghetti....which I make wonderfully!! As far as trying to do candles or whatever....he doesn't notice. If I had managed to get the kids to bed early to be alone with him, he will go wake them up to be with them. If I leave them at my moms for the night I get interrogated on why I would leave them there without his permission (though the purpose was to give us time alone). Those times, again, I end up going to bed alone while he either goes to his friends or sits in front of the TV watching soccer or some stupid tunisian game show. Sure he comes to me when HE is ready...which by them I have been asleep for awhile and quickly get irratated at being awaken so he can be satisfied.

    Last night he and I spoke about the children. He swears he would NEVER do that to me. He says he does want to live in Tunis but ONLY if I go with him. He would never have his kids grow up without their mother. But that it was his dream that we would all go to Tunisia to live. That we would have a beautiful life there. That he and I can't have a beautiful life here as I am too worried about what my family and friends will think of me in our relationship. Partly he is right. I don't want to be seen as the woman who compromised her entire life to be with a man. I mean in alot of ways, they would find that sad and pathetic.

    Pecola, I don't mind cleaning and cooking etc if he were working the way your husband seems to. But mine runs his own ice cream truck. He goes to work at 2:30 most days and is home by 8:30. It's an easy job first of all and secondly, he is then home all day. When I go to work early in the morning to the coffee shop we own he is in bed. He may get out of bed by 9 or so but if I am home he won't get up until 11:30. He watches the kids in the AM but will not lift a finger to pick up. I generally clean the house when I get home from work and straighten in the AM before I go back to work. Yet, when I get home it is always as if a toronado has hit. I am not even asking him to clean, in the true sense. I wish only for him to pick up behind himself as he goes to MAINTAIN the cleanliness. My husband has tunnel vision....dirt and messiness just does not bother him at all!!! The lawn mowing...well, I have refused to do it because he is home in the morning and could do it, just won't. I want it to look SO bad that it drives him crazy. Last night he promised to pay one of the little boys on his route to come and cut the grass. WELL, it will get the grass cut but it isn't the point!!! I guess he is the ultimate deligator. I swear if he gets no financial gain from something it doesn't require his attention.

    Arabi, I don't mean to be so stubborn! I am just afraid to be left looking a fool. Sometimes I think that I am that way so that he can't break my heart! But I don't want to give up my way of life either! I want to enjoy the beach the same as thousands of other people. I want to go to outdoor summer concerts with my friends as I have done for years without having to worry about the backlash at home for being even AROUND people who are drinking.....

    Sihem, I have no problems with Islam as I understand it, it is the same as Chrisitianity, for the most part. But, I do believe though alot of what it says pertained to that time in history, just as the Bible was. Christians, in the old testament were not supposed to eat pork either. The reason was because of the "parasites" that it carried in its body. This is no longer true (but just in case you are wondering...I DON'T eat pork out of respect for my husband). Things change and evolve. What was true then and had purpose, not necessarily pertains to present times. For example, a man is allowed 4 wives, yes I know the historical purposes for this, men getting killed leaving widows so brothers or other would marry them to care for them and their children. But today, would a Muslim woman not feel that it was a slap in the face that her husband would love/lust another woman, go to her and when it was the first wife's turn come back to her. It would disgust me to know my husband had touched another. I would be enraged with jealousy and who knows what I may do....My point is should this tradition take place now as it did then...NO!!! As I said before in an earlier post, I would have no problem converting to Islam if it were part of a moderate group. I could not follow it though in the way of Sharia or Islamic Law. You may as well shoot me first.

    Imed's friends love me too. In fact, the majority of them talk with me more than any of the other wives or girlfriends. As I stated about his friend Ali. They know they can count on me to be honest and even find my sinicism funny at times. We have good spirited debates! How ironic it is that some of his friends envy our marriage!! I think mainly because I do work and maintain the house while, sad to say, their wives, even though they are not working women, are not very good with taking care of their homes and spend money like water. They shop so much because they don't work I guess. ME....I hate to shop. So my husband should count himself lucky on that note! Hee Hee!!!

  1. Range_964
    Range_964

    ""Anyone who come to the US get edicted to it..can't leave.""

    sihem:

    i agree with almost everything you said, except the above statement... not everybody who goes to the u.s gets addicted to it.. may be you get addicted as well as many people but you can't say everybody.. for example me.. i wouldn't go there if you gave me millions.. my cuzin went there to see if he wanted to study there or to study in dubai.. he didn't feel comfortable there.. it's not because he's not open-minded or anything, he just didn't like it. i'm not saying that the u.s is not nice..but many people prefer to stay in their own countries than go live there or have the american nationality. other than this sihem.. i like ur comments and ur point of view. :)

  1. pecola
    pecola

    Diane,
    I read it all now, and I think I am up to date. You have alot of reasons to be concerned.It saddens me that you are going through all of this. It has to be extremely frustrating. I would never be the one to tell you to leave your husband. I know the sound of getting divorce again is even worse to think about. I am not sure if the good out weighs the bad here. First, you have to learn to cook some of his traditional meals. I wish I lived close because, I would truthfully come to your house everyday or you could bring the kids to mine. I remember trying to cook my husband's meals in the beginning, I SUCKED!!! We laughed about it but soon, I was doing it better than him.lolol Have you thought about taking classes? It seems like there is no light side because everything you try is shot down like a bird. I couldn't imagine having to deal with that kind of a personality. I don't think you should change who you are as a person because that was obviously who he fell in love with and once you lose yourself there is nothing and it takes a long time to get you back when you are ready and you realize by then time has past and it could be too late. I understand that alot of the community here expects you to convert and adopt his faith. Sihem was right you don't have to and I do not blame you because of what you see around you with your friends and so forth, as Sihem continue to say however, you have to respect that and he needs to respect that as well.Arabi was right when he says alot especially pertaining to the arab men's way of feeling about thier children. The husband looks at his children as an extention of life and they want to work harder to make life better for them and it goes down the line from our children to thier children, but that isn't much different from some Americans either. I feel the same about my children. I bust my bottom to ensure that my kids will have a fulfilling life and and be successful. It is not easy.I THINK Arabi said it well when he said that sometimes love just isn't enough.I feel you can do bad by yourself. The thought of your husband leaving or him leaving you probably kills you inside and I can only imagine what you think about as you close your eyes. I weak with my heart and would cry myself to sleep everynight I am sure. You have alot to think about and time is ticking away because the kids are getting older. If you were to decide maybe a seperation or divorce for right now they can still recover from that but the later it could turn into rebellion or resentment on thier parts. Have you tried writing him a letter expressing your feelings. I think sometimes it is better and you could ask that he only repsond to you with a letter. It reduces the stress level when you can pour your heart out on paper and say how you feel and let the other respond non verbally to reduce the raising of the voice. which may lead to a more heated argument and then you may not be able to keep your hands to yourself. I was very dissapointed when you told me that you slapped him and told him to deal with it. You guys are abusing each other and that is not cool to me because I have been there in my first marriage. He used to beat me and or slap or push me. He out a knife to my throat and that was it for me. You have to learn to walk away before you say or do something you may resent later.
    Arabi:
    I respect your opinion and truly appreciate your point of view,may Allah strike me down right now, however, my attitude, You would be pleased to know is in direct retaliation for a marriage that I hold dear to me, that you basically said was nothing. I work extremely hard at what we have hence is the reason you could only pull that 1 post where for the first time in maybe the whole forum, I had anything negative to say and my husband and myself read over everything I said Diane, Sihem and you and agreed with you on alot but then when he got to the end stated " He must not have either understood or read everything else you said". If you meant what you said to Diane then Diane should have been the only name not Diane & Pecola. No offense and please do not get angry. I am just trying to help you understand where I was coming from. My husband and myself enjoyed reading all the posts and the women AND the men (ARABI) are awesome :)
    Sihem:
    You are just sweet. I am not arab or muslim but I know better and honestly felt funny when I was on here even speaking about sex, that was why I asked Diane were her husband's friends wives American because I can not see Arab or muslim women discussing such a thing amongst others. I just felt out of place but wanted to explain without sounding too bad.lolol My husband told me to explain so I did and he said well it was the truth, LOLOLOL. Sihem, you are brave and please know we appreciate all you have inputed in this forum. You are a Gem!!
    Diane: You have my heart and I also feel excited to speak to you and others about different issues. Our lives are more alike than not alike. I face some of the issues you do and then there are things that I could not imagine you are going through. I feel he is not the right one for you. That is how I feel. My husband is my rock, my bestfriend, my cousin, my sister and everything. If I felt that we were losing that, then I would request a seperation to give each other time to reflect then if during that time we can not rekindle or find what made us love each other in the first place. That would be it. You can only try but this is a partnership and he has to want that as much as you to work and you need to have a common ground on where you guys want to see your future and the ways you are going to go about trying to achieve that goal.One can't go left and the other right. Hugs and Kisses

  1. the truth
    the truth

    diane how are you ...
    don't worry things will be alright bettween you and your husband ... you love each other and you'll be happy for a good time means forever ...

    well something else to not worry about only tunisia and turkey are the only 2 muslim country that haven't and will not legalize the polygamy and they will never have it so this is another point to not worry about ... it will be never possible for him to go back home alone and marry another women without divorcing you cause his embassy keeps tracking of everything and send it to his country and everything is send from the INS to the americain embassy in tunisia of all tunisian citizen in the usa that have files with INS for adjustement of status or any legal one...
    i've heard for a fact about someone who was seperated in the usa with his wife and he's from tunisia here and went marry back home in tunisia they almost put him in jail they told him you got to clairefy yourself first and get divorced in the usa and then you cna get married here ....
    + diane if you want more legal information about tunisia in the fields of the custody of childrens in case of divorce ( which's i hope it won't happend ) go the tunisian embassy web site or the legal web site of the amercain CIA and check the country of tunisia under national laws and foreigners laws in that section of sociolgical informtion that web site provide all the rights of the amercain citizen living there that web site have a lots of information and is really helpful for you ... to know oyur right if you move there or you stay here in the is while you're married to a tunisian citizen .

    good luck :>)

  1. Diane
    Diane

    Pecola,

    I so wish we did live close by! You are such a voice of reason. Please don't think that I am always violent against my husband, I am not. But he and I know how to push each others buttons. Somethings he says I can't bare. It has only happened once in our 4 year marriage that I smacked him. Not to say we haven't pushed each other though. I do NOT fear him in anyway. I hope the cooking part will get better. I have researched a place called "My Girlfriends Kitchen", where for $109.00 you pick your menu items online/phone, set up your appointment, go in and assemble 6 dinners that will feed 4-6people and walk out with bake and serve dinners. They provide all groceries and even cut the produce etc. For 20.00 more they will do it all and all I have to do is pick up the ready to cook entrees! Sounds like a winner for busy women everywhere!!!! I am excited.
    So maybe I can fool him into thinking I am getting better!!! He has already made it clear that when/if I go to Tunis, he wants me to spend my time in the kitchen with his mother and sister....sounds like a GREAT Vacation, right? Not to mention they don't speak English...guess I will need to brush up sur ma francais!!!

    Truth:
    You are a wealth of knowledge and that helps ease my concerns....could you answer one other question...will Tunisia law honor any custody agreements by US Courts?

    Bless you all! Insh allah ;) all will get better!!!

  1. pecola
    pecola

    TO THE WOMEN OF THE FORUM: PLEASE DON'T GET OFFENDED BY THE LORD NAME OR ANYTHING THIS IS JUST FOR WOMEN :)
    One Flaw In Women
    By the time the Lord made woman,
    He was into his sixth day of working overtime.
    An angel appeared and said,"Why are you spending so much time on this one?"
    And the Lord answered, "Have you seen my spec sheet on her?
    She has to be completely washable, but not plastic,have over 200 movable parts, all replaceable and able to run on diet coke and leftovers,have a lap that can hold four children at one time,have a kiss that can cure anything from a scraped knee to a broken heart,-and she will do everything with only two hands."

    The angel was astounded at the requirements.
    "Only two hands!? No way! And that's just on the standard model? That's too much work for one day.
    Wait until tomorrow to finish."
    But I won't," the Lord protested."I am so close to finishing this creation that is so close to my own heart. She already heals herself when she is sick,AND can work 18 hour days."

    The angel moved closer and touched the woman.
    "But you have made her so soft, Lord."

    "She is soft," the Lord agreed,"but I have also made her tough.You have no idea what she can endure or accomplish."

    "Will she be able to think?", asked the angel.

    The Lord replied,"Not only will she be able to think,she will be able to reason and negotiate."

    The angel then noticed something,and reaching out, touched the woman's cheek. "Oops, it looks like you have a leak in this model.I told you that you were trying to put too much into this one."

    "That's not a leak,"the Lord corrected,"that's a tear!"

    "What's the tear for?" the angel asked.

    The Lord said, "The tear is her way of expressing her joy,her sorrow, her pain, her disappointment, her love,her loneliness, her grief and her pride."

    The angel was impressed."You are a genius, Lord.
    You thought of everything!Woman is truly amazing."

    And she is!Women have strengths that amaze men.
    They bear hardships and they carry burdens,but they hold happiness,love and joy.They smile when they want to scream.They sing when they want to yell.They cry when they are happy and laugh when they are nervous.They fight for what they believe in.They stand up to injustice.They don't take"no" for an answer when they believe there is a better solution.They go without so their family can have.
    They go to the doctor with a frightened friend.
    They love unconditionally.They cry when their children excel and cheer when their friends get awards.They are happy when they hear about a birth or a wedding.Their hearts break when a friend dies.They grieve at the loss of a family member,yet they are strong when they think there is no strength left.They know that a hug and a kiss can heal a broken heart.Women come in all shapes, sizes and colors.They'll drive, fly, walk, run or e-mail you to show how much they care about you.The heart of a woman is what makes the world keep turning.They bring joy, hope and love.They have compassion and ideals.They give moral support to their family and friends. Women have vital things to say and everything to give.
    HOWEVER,
    IF THERE IS ONE FLAW IN WOMEN,IT IS THAT THEY FORGET THEIR WORTH.

    this is all too true. I hope you all enjoyed that because I was moved :) Have a great day :)
    Pecola

  1. pecola
    pecola

    Diane you are too funny.lolololol I don't think you hit him all the time or anything and trust me, I understand exactly what you mean. I guess I want you to be bigger but not submissive to the abuse and you know what I mean. I am not scared of anybody either and encourage you to be strong. I think you can make it especially if you believe in the love you guys have. Remember there is a learning curve amongst couples especially if you marry rather sooner than later. I remember when my husband and myself first started living together, I not only had trust issues but self esteem issues because I am on the heavier side as well. lol. I always felt that he may want to marry someone from his own country and so forth and so on. I felt inadequate towards myself not because he made me feel that way but because I felt that way about myself. Time has made me more cautious so that I had to check my self and realize I am the reason why I feel this way or that way. I had to take to heart everything that he was telling me because he would say...If I didn't love you or care about you, do you think I would tell you the right way or the wrong way? He says that he would let me do whatever I wanted to until he got tired of it and just leave. He says he just wants to get it all out in the open so we can discuss it or fix the problems, he doesn't want to hold it in. I love him more than ever for those words alone.Arab men and some men here too but more emphasis on the Arab or Muslim men, they are not always easy to love but they love hard.

  1. Diane
    Diane

    I never heard anyone put it like that love...but yes, they sure are HARD to love!!!! Imed has said those same words to me...."I love you and I want you to go the right path...so we can be together in heavan." I took it to mean he was saying those things to make me think the way he wants. You are just like me in so many ways. He tells me that I am always taking things in a bad way and that it isn't him saying things they are my mind putting things in the worst perspective.

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Range!

    Thank you for your comment. I do agree with you ...I should've not said everybody...There is an exception to each rule.....But I'd say some of them....

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Diane and Pecola!

    Both of yo guys should email eachother and be friends....YOu can look into each other since your husbands are both from the same country...you understand each other, and whenever one crosses the line with her husband, 5the other one will be there to advice....

    Good luck to you, and wish you all the happiness.
    PS: Arab men are taugh and easy at the same time...you just need to bush the right buttons at the right moment...

  1. Diane
    Diane

    We should definitely should!

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Diane,
    As an arab muslim man, I would hate to have a tough strong wife. What I mean by that; I like the woman to be a female in the true sense. She needs to be nice, sweet, loving and soft in her dealings. I don't want a B*tch.. if you know what I mean. I am not saying that she should be a weak and submissive person, NO. I need to be tickled by her intelligence and inner beauty just as much as her outer beauty. I just can't stand a woman that is always upset, screams, yells,
    constantly nagging and complaining. Some women use these tactics to force their ways. I will leave such a women EVEN if I loved her to death and had 20 kids. When I got married, I fell in love with this sweat woman with a big soft heart that can make me do anything she wants with a smile not a nag ;) My wife is an attorney and a very independent women. I love her to death and would do anything for her, because she makes me happy...

    I hate to admit, most men are like kids. Let us believe we are in charge and you will be the happiest woman ever and you will be in charge. Sometimes I feel we are so dumb to be fooled by the oldest trick in the book! But it works most of the time because we like it ;)

    Diane, before you try the divorce and the fighting, try to be loving. Try to start fresh and see if his attitude changes. If he chages a bit, then there is hope ;) Try to be the woman of his dreams, there is nothing wrong with that! Don't demand that he changes instanly in return. Men don't and don't understand the emotional needs of a woman instanly. It is not an isult to you, he is the man you love. Try that for a while and see if that changes him.

    Don't go the ugly route of divorce or seperation, until you have to. The kids will pay for your mistakes and his ignorance. What a shame :(

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Pecola,

    Your cool. I wish you and your husband all the happiness....

    Sihem,

    Your the greatest, I hope you find a man that deserves you ... Your bright, intelligent and brave... I can see you scaring them men away :)

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Arabi!

    Thank you for your conmpliment...You are right a lot of men get insecure when they are aroound me. That's my problem...I am myself, and I can't fake it...I am independent, sensitive, happy, may be too positive, I love my culture and my religion...I am proud to be a Muslim Arab...I just want, love, respect, honesty, and trust...It seems too much to ask theses days.

    You are a great man and husband and wish you a lot of success in your personnal life and carreer..

  1. PECOLA
    PECOLA

    SIHEM,

    We could be friends with you too. :) You offer ideas and insight that I could have never even thought about not knowing a tremendous amount about the history. I teach myself everyday something knew and reading what you have to say IS ENLIGHTENING!! pwilson@ballseed.com is my address. Feel free both Sihem and Diane to email me.

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Pecola!

    You are so sweet , thank you....

    You are right, a lot of Arabic women won't have the guts of talking about sex...
    We learn from our experiences and other people's experience. If you cannot have sex until marriage you better be knowledgeable, and educated about it to reduce the chance of mistakes in your life. That's apply in all different fields....Allah wants us to learn, from both life and school...

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    PS: You'll definitely hear from me. My email is Asihem1@aol.com. Looking forward for a great friendship...

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Ah Ok.. so this is what I get.. no one wants me to email them... My heart is broken ;(

    On a more serious note, hope you all find happiness and good luck with life.. see you around...

  1. Sihem from Los Angeles
    Sihem from Los Angeles

    Arabi!

    My email is Asihem1@aol.com....It's always great to keep in touch with a lawyer and wise man..

  1. PECOLA
    PECOLA

    Arabi,

    You have been such a revelation for me :) You can and I truly mean every word, can email me anytime. I know you will have something good to talk about because even in the previous forums you are very knowledgable and YOUR OPINION counts. I go to bed at night these past few days with a little bit of all of you on my mind and your thoughts. This is a truly enlightening place to talk about issues. This is the first time in my life where I have ever participated in an online discussion. Thank you guys for the experience.

    By the way what did youthink about the Michael Jackson verdict.lololol
    Pecola

  1. Jane
    Jane

    I came upon this website when I was looking up arab culture out of curiosity, and found this article about arab men and sex. What made me laugh is that when I read this there were 69 comments (now I am the 70th comment), I'm sure you get the joke. I live in Detroit, Michigan, FULL of Arabs from Iraq, Lebanon, Syria and Yemen. I have dated men of many different nationalities, and I must say Arab men are the most talented of them all! I was really surprised by Diane who said her husband could not satisfy her. Honey, I'm now 27 and have an Iraqi boyfriend and I have had the best sex of my life. True, many of them are timid because it is their first time, but they are raised with this manly sexual attitude that they use in bed. After some time Diane and Pecola, you will realize that your husbands are 10x better than any white man.

  1. Arabi
    Arabi

    Jane,

    LOL! I don't know what to say other than good for you!! You made me laugh with your comments. Kudos to your iraqi boyfriend for making you a happy woman!!

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